if you shoot someone trying to steal ur ****

do you go to jail?

do you go to jail? what did you do and i want nothing to do with it

do you go to jail? :idk:

Not in Texas... we have the right to protect property including the use of lethal force. It varies state to state. In Virginia you gotta be damn near death- before using lethal force and even then you're likely to face charges.

:idk: would depend on your local LEO n the circumstances :lol:

do you go to jail? depends on how good/expensive your lawyer is:lol:

In Texas we have the right to protect property and life with the use of lethal force. There are some catches, such as if you pause to reload the person must still be a threat when you begin shooting again but pretty much yea. I was always told by my grandfather that if I shot someone in the yard to pull them in the house before the cops arrived. If you try and rob a house in Texas, statistically, you have something like a 78% chance that there is a firearm of some sort in the house.

In Texas we have the right to protect property and life with the use of lethal force. There are some catches, such as if you pause to reload the person must still be a threat when you begin shooting again but pretty much yea. I was always told by my grandfather that if I shot someone in the yard to pull them in the house before the cops arrived. If you try and rob a house in Texas, statistically, you have something like a 78% chance that there is a firearm of some sort in the house. Yea think GA has something similar, long as you dont shoot em in the back or chase em down the street shooting them :lol:

It changes from state to state. I know in Georgia we have what are known as "Castle Laws". Which means if someone is in your home that isn't suppose to be there. It doesn't matter if they are butt naked with a peace sign. You can kill them. Even a shot in the back. It's the same way with your car to. If someone comes to your car with some form of a weapon (wether it be a baseball bat or bomb) you can defend yourself there. I do carry a pistol(s) sometimes when I ride my bike. Mainly on long rides. One will be a 44magnum revolver and sometimes when I carry two the other is a 357magnum. A good lawyer will help becuase if you kill someone you are likely going to jail no matter how in the right you are.

Yea think GA has something similar, long as you dont shoot em in the back or chase em down the street shooting them :lol: I believe a shot in the back is okay. But once they leave your doors you can't attack at all if they are fleeing.

A good lawyer will help becuase if you kill someone you are likely going to jail no matter how in the right you are. for a night at least :lol:

It changes from state to state. I know in Georgia we have what are known as "Castle Laws". Which means if someone is in your home that isn't suppose to be there. It doesn't matter if they are butt naked with a peace sign. You can kill them. Even a shot in the back. It's the same way with your car to. If someone comes to your car with some form of a weapon (wether it be a baseball bat or bomb) you can defend yourself there. I do carry a pistol(s) sometimes when I ride my bike. Mainly on long rides. One will be a 44magnum revolver and sometimes when I carry two the other is a 357magnum. A good lawyer will help becuase if you kill someone you are likely going to jail no matter how in the right you are. Smittie's last point is probably the most important. Unless someone's threatening you and you act in self-defense, better get a good lawyer cuz you're probably looking at jail time no matter what the law says.

well my roommate got home, he's a criminal justice major. he said that the guy would need to be threatening me in a deadly fashion. i.e. tried to run me over with the bike after i got in front of him, tried to stab or shoot me, punched me, kicked, etc. so went back outside and put a knife in the bastards hand :D :D

:lol:

If you try and rob a house in Texas, statistically, you have something like a 78% chance that there is a firearm of some sort in the house. I remember hearing that if you kill someone in Texas (Wether murder or defense) and you are proven guilty. That during the sentencing they take into account how much better off society is with this person's death. My guess is if you murder someone who was a honest doctor that is worse than if you murdered a person who was a wife beater. You still did wrong but I guess they somewhat justify the murder. As for the percentage. I'd be curious what that percentage is within the cities. Cities anywhere are notorious for your young hip yuppie anti-gun crowd. Criminals love that becuase they know they are the only ones with the guns. But go within a 30mile radius of King Ranch I bet it's close to 100% with theft around 0%.

I say kill all the F'ers. If someone cuts you off-BANG. If someone Jaywalks-BANG. If someone speeds-well, we'll let that one slide.:whistle:

In NC they have to have a deadly weapon and be a life threatening situation.

I wouldn't even report it... I'd take them to some far off remote location and torture them...

In F$^%in Mass if someone breaks in your house with a M60 and six grenades with some C4 strapped to their chest and I shoot them I will be charged with some type of manslaughter charges if there was a reasonable opportunity for me to flee... the only way I wouldn't be charged is if I was on the second floor of a home and trapped in a room with no access to an exit between me and the gunman. TOTAL CRAP ... damn liberal democrat motherf$#kers.... at least this upcoming election we will have another republican president..... come on the democrats have the worst choices .... I bet half the democrats will vote republican this election.... http://msnbcmedia2.msn.com/j/msnbc/Sections/Newsweek/Components/Photos/Mag/061218_Issue/061209_ClintonObama_vl.widec.jpg

yeah democrats really rolled the dice with demonizing bush and picking these to peeps to run. No way i would voted for Hilary

Libertarian all the way for me. However I'm curious as to who the Republicans are going to push. I know Gulliani, McCain, etc. But Gulliani is mayor of the liberal capital of the world. So how conservative can he be. And McCain lost out on the whole McCain Feingold BS that most Republicans aren't in favor of. I also think the Dems screwed the pooch by letting Hilliary and Obama cut each other so much this early. The absolute best ticket for them would have been Hilliary and Obama. That way you can play the race card along with the sex card. Because if you don't vote for Hilliary/Obama then you hate black people and beat women. I personally am not in favor of the beauty contest known as the Presidential Election and believe in voting restrictions. There is absolutely no Constitutional "Right" to vote. Infact it limited the amount of people who could vote in the beginning and was very very very specific about it. What I would really like to see is Ted Kennedy vs Ann Coulter. Both would make terrible presidents but damn it would be funny up to that point.

Libertarian all the way for me. However I'm curious as to who the Republicans are going to push. I know Gulliani, McCain, etc. But Gulliani is mayor of the liberal capital of the world. So how conservative can he be. And McCain lost out on the whole McCain Feingold BS that most Republicans aren't in favor of. I also think the Dems screwed the pooch by letting Hilliary and Obama cut each other so much this early. The absolute best ticket for them would have been Hilliary and Obama. That way you can play the race card along with the sex card. Because if you don't vote for Hilliary/Obama then you hate black people and beat women. I personally am not in favor of the beauty contest known as the Presidential Election and believe in voting restrictions. There is absolutely no Constitutional "Right" to vote. Infact it limited the amount of people who could vote in the beginning and was very very very specific about it. What I would really like to see is Ted Kennedy vs Ann Coulter. Both would make terrible presidents but damn it would be funny up to that point. The general public is too stupid to vote...

I say kill all the F'ers. If someone cuts you off-BANG. If someone Jaywalks-BANG. If someone speeds-well, we'll let that one slide.:whistle: :withstupi :lol: In MO if someone breaks into your house you can shoot them. Also, smittie, what kind of situations do you get yourself into where 1 44mag isn't enough?

:withstupi :lol: Also, smittie, what kind of situations do you get yourself into where 1 44mag isn't enough? Yeah really. Well the 44magnum despite it's a short barrel isn't that concealable. The 357 has a 1" barrel and it is. However hang the 44 on your side while cruising down the road on a bike people show a little more respect. You'll notice tailgaters suddenly decide they don't want to be on your tail or the tails of the 5cars that are now infront of them. http://a694.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/52/l_f80320793b4f172114ddc7c1c3796a35.jpg However when the 44magnum simply won't do. We have these... http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1289/715740717_433978c23d.jpg?v=0 5 shot 45-70Government with a special firebreather round and the black one a 454 Raging Bull that will rock your world. Infact we got our hands on some 2inch thick bullet proof glass and the 454 blew right through it. I'm really not a fan of Semi-auto pistols. If you can't get what you need done in 5-6 shots then you were screwed no matter what.

I live in Michigan and I think you can only strike back if someone is threatening you.. I know there is a concealed weapon permit required to carry a hand gun. While I am against most forms of violence I believe it is okay to defend yourself in a life threatening environment. I wouldn't carry a gun because it will lead to nothing but trouble.. As mentioned earlier you will still be in some kind of trouble even for defending your stuff... Sometimes its best to let something that could be VERY violent go...but I guess in the end if the person is gonna kill ya...Smoke the bastard...:idk: and on a side note I hope the Dems win the next election.. I'm not very in tune with the politics but I just think the current administration is nothing more than a joke.. Enough said...

so went back outside and put a knife in the bastards hand :D :D Thats why is good to keep a cheap, untraceable gun around. File off the serial number and file down the inside of the barrel. Fire off 1 shot and then place the gun the dead guys hand. You can claim self defense. Oh and it might be a good idea to drag the body inside your home before you call the police and clean up any blood outside before they get there.:dthumb: :leaving:

Thats why is good to keep a cheap, untraceable gun around. File off the serial number and file down the inside of the barrel. Fire off 1 shot and then place the gun the dead guys hand. You can claim self defense. Oh and it might be a good idea to drag the body inside your home before you call the police and clean up any blood outside before they get there.:dthumb: :leaving: Well LOL. Sounds like a good idea and all but since I have taken a forensics class that won't work. This stamping process actually goes deeper than the surface numbers indicate, so when you file the number off you see its gone HOWEVER the forensics person can grind the metal down past the deepest scrapes to get a strip of polished metal. When you add copper salts and hydrochloric acid, and that makes the strained area just beneath the stamped number dissolve at a faster rate than the metal around it. That temporarily brings up the number (or a partial), making it available for a photograph before it disappears. They can also figure out what tool you used as well as if the bullet came from the gun by the lands and grooves on the bullets and the way the firing pin strikes the bullet. IBIS - Integrated Ballistics Identification System is a national system. The system captures video images of bullet striations and of the markings left on cartridge cases. These images are used to produce an electronic signature that is stored in a database. The system then compares this signature to that of another fired bullet or cartridge case-or to an entire database of fired bullets and cartridge cases thats how alot of crimes are solved or they can link bullets to one certain gun. Cleaning up blood...well thats not easy either. All they need is ONE drop to hang you. Bleach will degrade blood evidence but you better clean up damn good. And lets not forget blood splatters. So if you shoot at a short distance they will be able to tell by the range of splatter and the type of drops,Our forensics are so good today that if the victim were to breathe on you thier DNA can be extracted from your skin or clothes. Thats why most have started wearing masks when collecting evidence at a crime scence as not to contaminate it. There is NO Perfect crime and the evidence never lies. If they don't catch you now they will :) (I love this stuff) Edited to add...If you fire the gun and place it in his hand you will still have gun residue on your hands and shirt.

Well LOL. Sounds like a good idea and all but since I have taken a forensics class that won't work. This stamping process actually goes deeper than the surface numbers indicate, so when you file the number off you see its gone HOWEVER the forensics person can grind the metal down past the deepest scrapes to get a strip of polished metal. When you add copper salts and hydrochloric acid, and that makes the strained area just beneath the stamped number dissolve at a faster rate than the metal around it. That temporarily brings up the number (or a partial), making it available for a photograph before it disappears. They can also figure out what tool you used as well as if the bullet came from the gun by the lands and grooves on the bullets and the way the firing pin strikes the bullet. IBIS - Integrated Ballistics Identification System is a national system. The system captures video images of bullet striations and of the markings left on cartridge cases. These images are used to produce an electronic signature that is stored in a database. The system then compares this signature to that of another fired bullet or cartridge case-or to an entire database of fired bullets and cartridge cases thats how alot of crimes are solved or they can link bullets to one certain gun. Cleaning up blood...well thats not easy either. All they need is ONE drop to hang you. Bleach will degrade blood evidence but you better clean up damn good. And lets not forget blood splatters. So if you shoot at a short distance they will be able to tell by the range of splatter and the type of drops,Our forensics are so good today that if the victim were to breathe on you thier DNA can be extracted from your skin or clothes. Thats why most have started wearing masks when collecting evidence at a crime scence as not to contaminate it. There is NO Perfect crime and the evidence never lies. If they don't catch you now they will :) (I love this stuff) Edited to add...If you fire the gun and place it in his hand you will still have gun residue on your hands and shirt. Thats why you stamp new numbers on there.:wink: And as far as gun residue, you're going to have that on you anyway when you shoot the guy in the first place.

The movie Boondock Saints has taught me that you can use ammonia to screw up blood. Also, the cops are gonna be a little suspicious that your entire front yard smells like bleach. Just remember, if there's no body, there was no murder.

Thats why you stamp new numbers on there.:wink: And as far as gun residue, you're going to have that on you anyway when you shoot the guy in the first place. They can still find the old ones :P More than one way to trace a gun! No matter how smart you are about it,man you always leave something behind! Perfect example is the movie Murder by Numbers....he vomited and they got him by his puke. :whistle:

They can still find the old ones :P More than one way to trace a gun! No matter how smart you are about it,man you always leave something behind! Perfect example is the movie Murder by Numbers....he vomited and they got him by his puke. :whistle: Doesnt matter, as long as it can never be traced back you you, then you are good to go. For self defense, you dont need much more to take care of. You're already anitting you were there. All you have to do is make sur ethe gun you put un the hands of the dead guy are wiped clean of your finger prints.

I hate a freakin' thief as bad as anybody and I conceal carry...BUT if you shoot someone around here for trying to steal your bike and you kill them...the only thing you'll be riding in the future is bubba in prison !!:flush: ...or get ridden...

Just don't call the cops... Kill the mofo, and bury him in a shallow grave... Problem solved.

Just don't call the cops... Kill the mofo, and bury him in a shallow grave... Problem solved. I like this approach.

I like this approach. Take it to the next level and bury him in a shallow grave on someone you don't like's property... Then make an anonymous payphone call talking about suspicious activity. Two birds, one dead body.

Just don't call the cops... Kill the mofo, and bury him in a shallow grave... Problem solved. Precisely the point I made earlier....if there's no body, there was no murder.

i say shoot him in his kneecap and cripple him for life. and when i get outta prison, he'll still be crippled.

:whistle: Precisely the point I made earlier....if there's no body, there was no murder. exactly i like how you think!

Just don't call the cops... Kill the mofo, and bury him in a shallow grave... Problem solved.:iagree: but i have a disposal system out here, my boat,little blood, couple miles west [of so cal is ocean] a rope and a bottle for me:cheers: shark fishin so much fun:whistle: :wink:

Yep the prisons are full of experts just like us.:lol: That's why I just keep full coverage on the bikes...steal it...sure...I may f*ck them up if I catch them...but chances are by the time I realize it...they will be long gone. I'm getting a new bike anyway.:idk:

Yep the prisons are full of experts just like us.:lol: :iagree: plum full of em :lol:

Yep the prisons are full of experts just like us.:lol: That's why I just keep full coverage on the bikes...steal it...sure...I may f*ck them up if I catch them...but chances are by the time I realize it...they will be long gone. I'm getting a new bike anyway.:idk: Indeed they are...then again the casebooks are full of unsolved crimes, too. Just look at OJ. This smiley doesn't mean anything, but I thought it looked cool :bthorse:DIE DIE DIE STUPID HORSE!

Yep the prisons are full of experts just like us.:lol: That's why I just keep full coverage on the bikes...steal it...sure...I may f*ck them up if I catch them...but chances are by the time I realize it...they will be long gone. I'm getting a new bike anyway.:idk: And empty of people smart enough to not get caught. :whistle:

at least this upcoming election we will have another republican president..... come on the democrats have the worst choices .... I bet half the democrats will vote republican this election.... I certainly hope people smarten up and realize the only way to have the country running smoothly is to have a democrat in office. Bitch about your taxes all you want, but at least the economy will be booming and things will be going well. Bill Clinton had this country in tip top shape and Bush ruined it within about a month. Economy is now in the chitter. Who cares if the guy got blowjobs on the side? He can get them all damn day as far as I'm concerned, at least the man knew how to run the country and had an IQ larger than his shoe size. You can't say that about our current a$$hole. I want Bill back, which is why I will vote for Hillary, since Bill will sort of be running things behind the scenes hopefully. Libertarian all the way for me. Libertarian is a silly vote because they will never win. At least put your vote towards the repubs or dems so it will actually count. The unfortunate part is that the libertarian and independent votes usually take away from the dems and not the repubs... :( The general public is too stupid to vote... :iagree: :withstupi current president, case in point.

:iagree: :withstupi current president, case in point. And not once, but twice!! :crazy:

Oh my I will stay away from this topic. All except for Hillary as president will be the worse thing this country has ever seen!!! Mark my words shes in it for the power n gives 2 chyts about the country. Bush isnt the greatest president I agree, is he really the worst?? by no means.

Oh my I will stay away from this topic. All except for Hillary as president will be the worse thing this country has ever seen!!! Make my words she in it for the power n gives 2 chyts about the country. Bush isnt the greatest president I agree, is he really the worst?? by no means. Hilary won't make it past the primaries, Obama is going to beat her. It's the democrats election to lose and they aren't doing a very good job so far. Hell none of the candidates impress me. I do like Fred Thompson, but he has as much of a chance as me winning.

I certainly hope people smarten up and realize the only way to have the country running smoothly is to have a democrat in office. Bitch about your taxes all you want, but at least the economy will be booming and things will be going well. Bill Clinton had this country in tip top shape and Bush ruined it within about a month. Economy is now in the chitter. Who cares if the guy got blowjobs on the side? He can get them all damn day as far as I'm concerned, at least the man knew how to run the country and had an IQ larger than his shoe size. You can't say that about our current a$$hole. I want Bill back, which is why I will vote for Hillary, since Bill will sort of be running things behind the scenes hopefully. Libertarian is a silly vote because they will never win. At least put your vote towards the repubs or dems so it will actually count. The unfortunate part is that the libertarian and independent votes usually take away from the dems and not the repubs... :( :iagree: :withstupi current president, case in point. ummm how can you discount the 2002-2005 housing price increase, the dow went from just above 10,000 to 14000 to say that the "economy is in the chitter" president's rarely have much to do with an economic boom or bust. Not say I am a bush fan because i despise him, but much of prosperity experienced under Clinton did not have much to do with him.

back to the actual topic. in nyc you cant just go and apply for a concealed gun permit. you NEED to PROVE you need a gun. which is fxcking stupid if you ask me. and even then you'll get the permit but if you ever use the gun, you eithe rbetter be real good friends with someone up there or giving bloomberg a bj otherwise you're going to jail for a whiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiile

[QUOTE=z06boy;402466] That's why I just keep full coverage on the bikes...steal it...sure...I may f*ck them up if I catch them...but chances are by the time I realize it...they will be long gone. QUOTE] You can put a hidden nitrous shot of 100hp on your bike that activates if it is stolen and will go off around 80mph if someone guns it thus sending them into an uncontrolable wheelie in which they'll hopefully plow into a semi-truck. So Totaled bike and Totaled rider. What's not to like. As for shooting them in a knee cap and crippling them. Well once they get done suing you for everything you own (The irony), they'll finish up with taking taxpayers money through welfare and disabilities(Plus an easy parking spot for getaways from the grocery store). All because you missed. Dead is better. As for voting Libertarian. I know my vote is wasted but I'm not voting for the "Lesser of two evils". Because the way I look at it is if we grab 6% of the vote no matter who wins will take notice and realize that they are going to slowly die out unless they change. And for Hilliary. Part of me wants her to win with the Dems taking a lot of control of the legislative branch and Judicial branch. That way we can finally put our country into the ruin we are slowly falling into right now. And hopefully we aren't that sissified once our freedoms, money, and livelyhood is taken away. Which hopefullly we will finally stand up and realize what we lost and fight for it back. Because our founding fathers were a minority and managed to set up a system that took us from a loose band of vagabounds to the envy of the world in less than 200years.

back to the actual topic. in nyc you cant just go and apply for a concealed gun permit. you NEED to PROVE you need a gun. which is fxcking stupid if you ask me. and even then you'll get the permit but if you ever use the gun, you eithe rbetter be real good friends with someone up there or giving bloomberg a bj otherwise you're going to jail for a whiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiile Think everybodies favorite fascist mayor for that rudy....I love being in the south were everybody regardless of political affiliation is armed to the teeth.

Think everybodies favorite fascist mayor for that rudy....I love being in the south were everybody regardless of political affiliation is armed to the teeth. Very true. I'd like to see someone break into Democrat Zell Miller's home up there in Young Harris, GA. He'd probably shoot them and then bury them near his moonshine distillery. However in the GA, TN, NC,SC mountains you can get away with stuff like that. It's why Eric Rudolph never got caught until he wanted to. Oh yeah the New York thing reminded me of something. Michael Moore had two bodygaurds that got arrested at the NYC airport for carrying a concealed weapons. They had permits but they were no good in NY. I guess he "Needed" them but us poor folks that he is looking out for don't.

All I'm going to say about this politics stuff is that I am republican and my best friend is the most liberal guy I know and we argue all the time, but when it comes down to it we both want the same thing and will probibly vote the same way in the next election.

I wonder what issues the dems will be discussing for the upcoming election let alone any issues for both candidates... the war for certain.... hopefully health care.... any ideas?:2cents:

here, as I remember, we have the castle law, but to be able to legally kill someone, they must be either on your property AND threatening you in a manner that could kill you without any viable means of escape, OR just threatening you in a manner in which you could be killed without means for escape. I think its BS though. it should be, they come in your house and you kill them, so long as they were a menace to society such as a habitual criminal, or someone who beat their wife and kids repeatedly, that you dont go to jail. but if you killed an honest person for no good reason, THEN you dont go to jail, but once it is proven that you did it, death on the spot. sorry, thats how I think it should be in an ideal world.

I certainly hope people smarten up and realize the only way to have the country running smoothly is to have a democrat in office. Bitch about your taxes all you want, but at least the economy will be booming and things will be going well. Bill Clinton had this country in tip top shape and Bush ruined it within about a month. Economy is now in the chitter. Who cares if the guy got blowjobs on the side? He can get them all damn day as far as I'm concerned, at least the man knew how to run the country and had an IQ larger than his shoe size. You can't say that about our current a$$hole. I want Bill back, which is why I will vote for Hillary, since Bill will sort of be running things behind the scenes hopefully. Libertarian is a silly vote because they will never win. At least put your vote towards the repubs or dems so it will actually count. The unfortunate part is that the libertarian and independent votes usually take away from the dems and not the repubs... :( :iagree: :withstupi current president, case in point. So don't vote on who you like, vote on the person most likely to win who you kinda like? And yep, Dems are the best for this country... Reagan sure did some amazing things. Oh my I will stay away from this topic. All except for Hillary as president will be the worse thing this country has ever seen!!! Mark my words shes in it for the power n gives 2 chyts about the country. Bush isnt the greatest president I agree, is he really the worst?? by no means. Hitlery is scary... SCARY. It's funny... Nobody wants to talk about unemployment being down and other positives Bushy has made... Heh, I hate him. ummm how can you discount the 2002-2005 housing price increase, the dow went from just above 10,000 to 14000 to say that the "economy is in the chitter" president's rarely have much to do with an economic boom or bust. Not say I am a bush fan because i despise him, but much of prosperity experienced under Clinton did not have much to do with him. :thx1:

president's rarely have much to do with an economic boom or bust. That's not true at all. As I said in another thread, the party of the president often determines the party to which the senate and house are leaned. This has a HUGE effect on the economy. So don't vote on who you like, vote on the person most likely to win who you kinda like? Exactly. Wasted votes don't help anyone. Give it up, people like Ralph Nader or Ross Perot are never going to win. Put your vote somewhere it could make a difference. If all the people who voted independent or libertarian or whatever put their votes toward democrats in the previous two elections, Bush wouldn't have been elected and our country wouldn't be completely f&*ked up right now, the economy would be good, and we wouldn't be fighting a war we can't win. God damn stupidity of the masses. :cursin: [/rant]

I have to disagree. I think that people should vote for whoever best suits their views. Too many people have the view that they should vote Democrat or Republican, and this view affords the leadership of those parties far too much power in choosing who is running our country. All they have to do is put someone up, and they know that a certain percentage of people are gonna vote for that person, regardless of how competent they are.

That's not true at all. As I said in another thread, the party of the president often determines the party to which the senate and house are leaned. This has a HUGE effect on the economy. Exactly. Wasted votes don't help anyone. Give it up, people like Ralph Nader or Ross Perot are never going to win. Put your vote somewhere it could make a difference. If all the people who voted independent or libertarian or whatever put their votes toward democrats in the previous two elections, Bush wouldn't have been elected and our country wouldn't be completely f&*ked up right now, the economy would be good, and we wouldn't be fighting a war we can't win. God damn stupidity of the masses. :cursin: [/rant] DANGER WILL ROBINSON!!! DANGER!!! The more votes the independants get, the more the lobbyist will start feeding them money. That is the only way this country is ever going to change.:2cents:

I have to disagree. I think that people should vote for whoever best suits their views. Too many people have the view that they should vote Democrat or Republican, and this view affords the leadership of those parties far too much power in choosing who is running our country. All they have to do is put someone up, and they know that a certain percentage of people are gonna vote for that person, regardless of how competent they are. Well, that's just the way it is. So why waste your vote somewhere else? Fairy tale happy endings don't happen when the majority of your country's residents are mindless drones.

Well, that's just the way it is. So why waste your vote somewhere else? Fairy tale happy endings don't happen when the majority of your country's residents are mindless drones. I just can't bring myself to vote for someone I don't believe in. I'm not going to piss my vote away on some idiot, regardless of how stupid the rest of the country is.

DANGER WILL ROBINSON!!! DANGER!!! The more votes the independants get, the more the lobbyist will start feeding them money. That is the only way this country is ever going to change.:2cents: :iagree: Lobbyists run this country. Don't ever for a minute think otherwise.Hell, Boeing advertises Jet fighter aircraft on the metro in DC.All these idealists that come to DC thinking they will change it-:wbs: They find out they like the power,status and perks that come with the job and become a different person.

Indeed they are...then again the casebooks are full of unsolved crimes, too. Just look at OJ. Yea but Johnnie Cochran is dead now. :lol: And empty of people smart enough to not get caught. If your bike is the one getting stolen and the guy ends up dead/missing...good luck with getting away with it...sure it could happen but like I said...the prisons are full of people that thought they were good enough to get away with it. I/you possibly could kill someone and not get caught but most likely it wouldn't be killing the fool that was trying to steal our bike...unless it happened later...way later...not while he was in the act of stealing it though.

I JUST did this very same story YESTERDAY. Here's the deal...a convenience store had a history of break in's. So the store owner started sleeping in the office with a shotgun. Thursday nite 3 people break into his store. He's comes out with the gun. Shoots one of them. Turns out the burgler DID NOT have a weapon. Burgler is in CRITICAL condition in Baltimore Hospital. Citizens are calling the store owner a hero. Police say he is facing MAJOR charges. Look at the story: Click HERE (http://www.abc27.com/news/stories/0807/444815.html)...then click "WATCH THE VIDEO" at the top. I shot the whole story.

[QUOTE=marko138;403723Here's the deal...a convenience store had a history of break in's. So the store owner started sleeping in the office with a shotgun. Thursday nite 3 people break into his store. He's comes out with the gun. Shoots one of them. Turns out the burgler DID NOT have a weapon. Burgler is in CRITICAL condition in Baltimore Hospital. .[/QUOTE] This was way before my time but might give an example of how times have changed. My friend's father who is a gun nut pretty much knows every major gun store owner in Atlanta. And he knew this guy who owned a gun store in Tucker, GA. Recently there were a bunch of smash and grab jobs in which they'd run a truck into the store throw the guns in and leave. They couldn't get caught either. THe police came and warned the store owner that his place would probably be hit soon. He asked "What if I camp out at the store and shoot them when they come in?". The cops told him he couldn't do that with his alarm system attached. He then asked "What if it is broken and I wait". They said that is fine. So he cut his alarm system and told the company that he'd appreciate it if they took a very long time to fix it. So they did. That night a truck and two men come busting through the shop. He happened to have a fully auto Browning BAR 30-06 rifle ready to roll. So he unloaded in them and there were dead right there and suddenly no one was robbing gun stores. He didn't get into trouble either.

thats what im talking about,kill em dead problem sloved,no cost to tax payers. remember laws arent for criminals, CAUSE THEY DONT CARE THATS WHY THERE CRIMINALS