Honda Litre+'s/250s. Why don't they have any? - TwoWheelForum: Motorcycle and Sportbike forums
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post #1 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-23-2007, 11:17 PM Thread Starter
 
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Honda Litre+'s/250s. Why don't they have any?

Looking at the possibility of a 250 GSXR to compete with the Kawasaki 250. I noticed that Honda doesn't really have anything to compete with the two different spectrums of the bike world.

I know they had the Blackbird for a while but they discontinued it. You would think that Honda would attempt to compete with the Hayabusa/ZX-14s and also no compete with smaller sportbikes.

Because if someone is new to motorcycles and wants a sport style bike. With Honda they don't have really any options other than Cruisers and the Honda 599 which is naked anyways. But if they want a fairings sport bike they'll have to go with a 600rr. Which I think the F4i is about to be discontinued but still not a good beginner bike.

I think if Honda put full/semi fairings and clip on bars on a 599 it would sell up there with the GS500 or SV650s.

Or are there any plans for a new Litre+ or beginner sport bike with Honda???

Because Honda is known for dependibility even among the Japanese big 4. So why not try to grab the newbies before they become "Gixxer" or "Zixxer" loyalists.
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post #2 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-23-2007, 11:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atlantasmittie84 View Post
Looking at the possibility of a 250 GSXR to compete with the Kawasaki 250. I noticed that Honda doesn't really have anything to compete with the two different spectrums of the bike world.

I know they had the Blackbird for a while but they discontinued it. You would think that Honda would attempt to compete with the Hayabusa/ZX-14s and also no compete with smaller sportbikes.

Because if someone is new to motorcycles and wants a sport style bike. With Honda they don't have really any options other than Cruisers and the Honda 599 which is naked anyways. But if they want a fairings sport bike they'll have to go with a 600rr. Which I think the F4i is about to be discontinued but still not a good beginner bike.

I think if Honda put full/semi fairings and clip on bars on a 599 it would sell up there with the GS500 or SV650s.

Or are there any plans for a new Litre+ or beginner sport bike with Honda???

Because Honda is known for dependibility even among the Japanese big 4. So why not try to grab the newbies before they become "Gixxer" or "Zixxer" loyalists.
the F4i was discontinued in 2006. I bet if the gixxer 250 comes about honda will start selling their 125/250 here too. Far as a hypersport dunno.
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post #3 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-23-2007, 11:35 PM
 
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I'd love for Honda to sell a CBR250, and see something from them to compete with the ZX14/Busa. discontinuing the F4i was a rather big mistake for Honda, considering its popularity as a general purpose bike.

If Honda built a CBR 250 for the US market, I'd buy one, just to have it.
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post #4 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 12:25 AM
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Cananada has them don't they?
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post #5 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 12:29 AM
 
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Honda made 250's including a Rebel, Nighthawk, and their great V-twin Interceptor, the VT250. And I'm sure there were more. The problem is nobody bought them.
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post #6 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 12:37 AM
 
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i reading about the old cbr 250 hurricane a few nights ago. tiny 4-stroke 4 banger. musta been a blast to ride. i wonder what kinda redline you could get with such light rotating parts i wouldnt think 20k+ was out of the question providing some real nasty valvesprings were used. hmm maybe air poppets? damn, that would be awesome
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post #7 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 12:41 AM
 
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last post got me thinking so i did some checking. the cbr250 hurricane was good for 18k out of the box way back in the eighties, so my previous thoughts are well within the realm of possibility given the 20 years of new tech.
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post #8 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 07:29 AM
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IMO! The problem is that not enough beginers actualy start with 250s to make a big enough profit for them to import the 250! Other countrys are happy with 250s as everyday rides! The litre+ is also a bike for select few, and anyone who rodes one could do the same things on the street with the cbr1! So they feel that by only puting ou a few models they are saving money on production, research, and shipping. And you will inevitably just pic one of the bikes which they offer!

Though now that more are doing it they may change their thought process soon!

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post #9 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 07:52 AM
 
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It's all about the numbers. MOST sport riders want a midrange (600-750cc) or a liter bike. The 250/500 and liter+ are niche markets. Honda might not have entered those markets (in the US anyway) because they don't feel it's worth it/won't make enough in sales.
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post #10 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 08:56 AM
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It's all about the numbers. MOST sport riders want a midrange (600-750cc) or a liter bike. The 250/500 and liter+ are niche markets. Honda might not have entered those markets (in the US anyway) because they don't feel it's worth it/won't make enough in sales.
Exactly!

~600!

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post #11 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 12:11 PM
 
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It really is curious why Honda ignores alot of street bike segments though. The VFR is an age old V4 design with no real upgrades since it went to 800cc. The ST1300 tourer is exactly the way it was 10 years ago. The CBR1100xx just dropped out, as did the SuperHawk and the RC51. The 919/599 series fades in and out, the Varadero shoulda sold here against the V Strom but was Euro only.

Yeah they do the 600 and 1000 sport class well and update frequently but they just don't change it up the way Suzuki, Kawasaki, or Yamaha does. Maybe Honda is too busy with Dirt bikes and ATV's?? Maybe it's car division eats up all the R&D money?

The beginner 250/500 cc segment may just be such a low $$ small peice of the pie they don't want to mess with it.
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post #12 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 12:30 PM
 
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It really is curious why Honda ignores alot of street bike segments though. The VFR is an age old V4 design with no real upgrades since it went to 800cc. The ST1300 tourer is exactly the way it was 10 years ago. The CBR1100xx just dropped out, as did the SuperHawk and the RC51. The 919/599 series fades in and out, the Varadero shoulda sold here against the V Strom but was Euro only.

Yeah they do the 600 and 1000 sport class well and update frequently but they just don't change it up the way Suzuki, Kawasaki, or Yamaha does. Maybe Honda is too busy with Dirt bikes and ATV's?? Maybe it's car division eats up all the R&D money?

The beginner 250/500 cc segment may just be such a low $$ small peice of the pie they don't want to mess with it.
thought i read something recently about an upgrade to the vfr sometime soon?
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post #13 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 01:43 PM
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I'd like to see them bring the rc back!

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post #14 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 02:12 PM
 
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I have heard VFR rumors for 3 years...V5 one minute, sportier V4 the next. I will give them one thing Honda keeps there stuff secret. Hard to know just what they have until the first leak/peak at the International shows...

Hard to believe that the RC51/Superhawks were discontinued. They really only have 2 sport bikes in their arsenal. Yeah the F4i is there but I don't think they will produce any more once supply runs out.
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post #15 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-24-2007, 07:44 PM Thread Starter
 
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Honestly I see more 250 Ninja's kicking around than your bigger sport bikes. But with the high gas a lot of people are getting into commuter bikes who have no plans to run 160mph+.

I guess one of Honda's problem is because of how dependable they are they are generally higher in price. So someone looking into a 250 is probably not going to pay $3300 for a Honda when they can get a Kawasaki for $3000(Example not actual prices).

I also agree about Honda having money elsewhere.

But for me if I ever moved to the East Coast(Which I hope to do in a few years) with no twisties I'd probably buy a litre plus bike and would get a Honda if available new.
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post #16 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-26-2007, 07:33 PM

 
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I'd like to see them bring the rc back!
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I have heard VFR rumors for 3 years...V5 one minute, sportier V4 the next. I will give them one thing Honda keeps there stuff secret. Hard to know just what they have until the first leak/peak at the International shows...

Hard to believe that the RC51/Superhawks were discontinued. They really only have 2 sport bikes in their arsenal. Yeah the F4i is there but I don't think they will produce any more once supply runs out.
Bring back the Blackbird!
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post #17 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-26-2007, 07:51 PM
 
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eh, they allready build the best bikes in the 600/1000 class's why mess with perfection?
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post #18 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-27-2007, 11:27 PM Thread Starter
 
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eh, they allready build the best bikes in the 600/1000 class's why mess with perfection?
It'd be kind of nice to have other options.

Later on down the road I'd like to upgrade my bike but get something similar to a GSXR 750. Good midrange TQ but more nimble than a Litre and not as powerful. I love Honda but don't want a CBR1000 nor do I want to tear into a 600 motor and bore it up. (I know the VFR800 but I'm talking Inline 4s)

Or if I move to the coast or flat areas with no twisties I wouldn't mind a "Hyperbike"(Is that what you call Litre+ bikes) since all I'll have is long flat roads. So having something more comfortable that can run 200mph would appeal to a lot of people. But they have to go to Kawasaki or Suzuki for that if they want newer versions.

And of course your smaller bikes have a market. And if there was a 250cc 4stroke racing league in Georgia I'd do it for sure. I'd go with the Ninja 250 just for cost reasons but I'm sure others would love to go Honda.

Maybe Honda has something in the works but they sure are lagging behind.
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post #19 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-28-2007, 12:09 PM

 
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So where are you sayin' you'll be running those 200+ speeds? Got some salt flats in mind?
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post #20 of 23 (permalink) Old 12-28-2007, 01:29 PM
 
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Honda really does need a Blackbird replacement. Hell if they were still making the original I would be interested. Classy, comfy, powerful without all that Hayabusa/ZX14 attitude.

And the VFR doesn't really equate into the middle of the 600/1000 sandwich. Far to heavy and street oriented to be thought of in the same breathe as a GSXR750. And if your sporty and want less than the 600's extreme race replica hp/ergo's your S.O.O.L. You'd have to buy a Shadow for cryin out loud...
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